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I'm wondering about Blanche de Belgique and resistance to blackspot. I came across comments on a gardening forum where someone in Italy said their plant had trouble with blackspot. I am just outside New York City, and our summers get plenty of rain and lots of humidity. Anything prone to blackspot will get it here (and I only use organic practices). I would love to plant this rose, but don't want to unless I am more certain it can thrive here.
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#1 of 1 posted
6 JUL 20 by
Hondudog
For all bad fungus (powdery mildew, blackspot, and the killer Downey mildew, I use 3 cups cornmeal slightly dug or fluffed into the soil (so birds don’t eat it all) and watered in. In a hotter climate you might repeat 2x a year but this kills all soil spores and fixes the problem with no chemicals and no spraying. In a last ditch effort to save what was left of someone else’s potted roses, I tried this for Downey mildew. Nothing else had worked for me before, but this did and saved most of the affected roses. If you can get an agricultural grade (often sold in 30 and 50 lb sacks) it is significantly cheaper than grocery store stuff!
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Initial post
1 JUN 09 by
jedmar
Most of the pictures of 'Rose du Roi à fleurs pourpres' show a probable impostor: a rose which has a modern look to it, and does not fit into the Portland category. Are there any views on this?
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#1 of 4 posted
7 OCT 12 by
mtspace
I think it is probable that "Rose du Roi" and "Rose du Roi a Fleurs Pourpres" have been confused from time to time. And I think there certainly is a at least one rose with dark purple flowers that has a more modern look to it that has been sold under one or the other of the names above for some time. I notice that Vintage Gardens sells two roses under the moniker "Rose du Roi" which they subtitle "(of commerce)" and "(original)." These they list as Damask Perpetuals, as they seem to fit that description well. They also sell "Rose du Roi a Fleurs Pourpres" as a Hybrid Perpetual. Here, again, their dark purple rose has the long petals that impart a modern look to the rose, especially in bud. This organizational schema solves most of the more serious practical problems of distinguishing these three different cultivars from each other going forward. While it might be inconsistent with some of the history, it's clear that the history of these roses has some inconsistencies and/or missing information.
I notice, too, that if all the photos of the dark purple rose with long petals listed here under the two entries that contain "Rose du Roi" were moved into "Rose du Roi a Fleurs Pourpres" and all the ones that depicted a more damascene flowers in crimson tones were moved to "Rose du Roi" most of the glaring problems with the photos would go away. We may never know what has actually happened, but it might be possible to make things a bit clearer for future rose growers. Just a thought.
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#2 of 4 posted
8 NOV 12 by
evan500
Thank you mtspace for your clarification on this. I have been consulting books and various online rose sellers' websites the last week or so trying to make sense out of this. I wanted to purchase one of them, but was confused about the differences. I ended up buying Rose du Roi (original) from Vintage Gardens which I think I will be happy with but wasn't exactly confident on the distinctions.
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#3 of 4 posted
14 APR 16 by
AlanaSC
Take a look at the two pictures I just posted. They were sold as Rose du Roi, but later found out it was not the original, so through photo's figured it was this one.
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#4 of 4 posted
22 AUG 16 by
Hardy
Here's another tidbit to thicken the mystery. The recently released paper, 'Nineteenth century French rose (Rosa sp.) germplasm shows a shift over time from a European to an Asian genetic background,' tested over a thousand roses to see how they grouped genetically. Their sample of Mogador, from Loubert Rose Garden, was a diploid that fit into a genetic group with some bourbons, polyanthas, noisettes and a couple of HTs. While I could believe that the original might have had some bourbon ancestry, I would really not expect diploidy!
And mislabeled Mogador is nothing new, Graham Stuart Thomas (The GST Rose Book, p.147) had some which could be traced back to 1893, but said it "produces fairly constantly medium-sized blooms with surprisingly high centres for its period... It is doubtful whether this rose is correctly named; it bears no resemblance to 'Rose du Roi'. The original 'Rose du Roi' was raised at Sevres in 1819 and figured in Jamain et Forney, Plate 58, showing the typical 'high shouldered' effect, with the top leaf immediately under the flower."
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I had this rose growing and blooming in 4 hrs sun a day in a pot and the blooms always came out perfect. It had no disease problems. So this rose is shade-tolerant.
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We noted the shade tolerance in the plant's description but we're hesitant to label it as disease resistant based on just your experience as that may be a result of your particular gardening practices. Anyone else care to comment on how disease resistant this rose is for them?
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#2 of 9 posted
6 JUL 11 by
evan500
I live in New York state (Westchester County). I've had Black Magic for a little over a year (I planted it in about June of 2010). This year I am noticing more black spot then I did last year. I'd say my three foot high plant has lost close to half its leaves. I don't use commercial fungicides in my garden. Last year I often used the common baking soda solution to combat black spot, but my sense is that it helps some, but is no great cure. This year the only thing I have been doing is removing diseased foliage, including fallen dead leaves.
I do love the gorgeous red black flowers, but if I continue to see this level of black spot, I probably won't keep this plant. Since taking a class last year on "going green with roses" I am moving towards old garden varieties which, in general, seem to be more disease resistant. It is very disappointing, but in my experience, a majority of hybrid tea roses when grown in New York's hot humid summers are afflicted with black spot.
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#3 of 9 posted
8 JUL 11 by
Jay-Jay
You might try this mixture from a recipe of the Rosarium of Winschoten: for every 5 liter=> 10 grams of magnesiasulphate 10 grams of spraying-sulphur 10 grams of Algeco (concentrated Algae-extract) 35 ml of Vital (a leaf fertilizer) 25 grams of baking soda 25 ml of sunseedoil 1.25 ml of (dishwashing) detergent For me it works (but not for the rose Sunrise/Freisinger Morgenröte)
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#4 of 9 posted
8 JUL 11 by
evan500
Thanks, I appreciate the info!
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Oh, there are more than just OGRs that fit the bill now for "going green".
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#6 of 9 posted
19 JUN 14 by
Jay-Jay
Could You explain the abbreviation OGR?
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"Since taking a class last year on "going green with roses" I am moving towards old garden varieties which, in general, seem to be more disease resistant. It is very disappointing, but in my experience, a majority of hybrid tea roses when grown in New York's hot humid summers are afflicted with black spot."
OGR is the American abbreviation for old garden roses.
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#8 of 9 posted
20 JUN 14 by
Jay-Jay
Thank You! And good luck with Your new insight.
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Oh, I was just quoting what I was referencing. It is not my quote :] I mostly grow non-OGRs resistant to most blackspots. For example, Yellow Submarine.
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Available from - Greenmantle
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