HELPMEFIND PLANTS COMMERCIAL NON-COMMERCIAL RESOURCES EVENTS PEOPLE RATINGS
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'Pape Jean Paul II ®' rose Reviews & Comments
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Initial post
19 AUG 19 by
styrax
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How is blackspot resistance for this rose on the East Coast of the US?
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It's excellent - I don't spray and it doesn't have any black spot. 6b Pennsylvania here
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It contracts blackpot in my eastern North Carolina garden unless I spray regularly. It is robust and tries to grow through it. A powerhouse flower producer with great scent. The best white on the market.
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One could argue with that Steve. Have you tried Clouds of Glory and Soft Whisper ((not to mention Moonstone, Marlon's Day and Randy Scott)? I prefer these two over PJPII and I grow two bushes of each. COG is not quite as fragrant but grows better with longer, straighter stems and gives me more good blooms. Soft Whisper is equal in fragrance and a sturdy upright grower. The other three are really good exhibition varieties. I like PJPII but can't agree it's the best white on the market.
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I also own Soft Whisper. It is more susceptible to disease than JPII and not as fragtrant. Nor does it produce near the number of blooms. Nor is it white. And my comment concered John Paul II being the best white rose.
I am not familar with Clouds of Glory. It may be wonderful. But I am getting rid of my Soft Whisper this year and hanging on to my John Paul II.
It is pollen and seed fertile, but does both reluctantly. Soft Whisper is better at setting seeds than JPII.
Of course, we can only speak from limited experience and from our own gardens.
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Steve, have you grown 'Honor'?
If so, how would you rate it?
One of my all time favorite whites is 'Pascali'.
Thanks, Robert
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Yes, I grew honor years ago, along with Pascali.
I loved Pascali more ...
But I think neither of them can compete with the combined qualities of Pope John Paul II.
I may have an exceptional plant, but my JPII produces huge numbers of near perfect, fragrant flowers. And my climate is often drought ridden with 95 degree heat. The flowers hardly shrink in size or number. It is a very impressive plant. I am trying to work a line breeding it with ICECAP. Hoping to eventually produce something close to JPII with disease resistance.
Imagine a disease free 'Iceberg' with powerful fragrance! We can dream...
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I've never grown JPII
I do grow it's seed parent, Secret, which I like
I told Certified Roses they were wasting their time looking for a better white flori, because Iceberg will always outsell all other white floris because it's non-pat, easy to propagate and sold cheaply everywhere.
As for more recent fragrant white floris, I tried 'Bolero'. I hated it and tossed it out.
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I see by all your comments that you are a dedicated rosarian.
You must try JPII. I beleive it will be "THE WHITE ROSE" of this generation.
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Thanks for your input Steve.
I've been growing/breeding roses for some time. HT's are not an emphasis for me.
As I already have 'Secret' established I may trying playing with that a bit.
Space and time are always at a premium.
Best Wishes, Robert
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Haha, we all have strong opinions don’t we?? I will chime in for Honor, I still like it. Second best would be Sugar Moon and then PJP II. For me it is the weird bulbous shape of PJP II that puts it in third. I have grown all of the discussed hybrid teas. For best white florrie, I abhor iceberg and like Moondance, Grand Prize and Easy Spirit (the best) and Pillow fight.
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Hi Kathy, I'm guessing growing conditions account for many differences in opinion.
Yes, I still like Honor too. I think it's better for cutting than some others.
I also grow, and like, 'Easy Spirit'.
I hadn't considered, Moondance, Sugar Moon.
Now they are on my radar.
Thank you!
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The best white HT imo is 'Royal Philharmonic', but its not as fragrant. It's a real do'er, and it stays in its lane, unlike some HTs that grow whatever dimensions they please.
'Renaissance' is my favorite sniffer, but its very informal and has a blush to it. It's a heavy producer when mature. A love it and leave it type, which is preferable.
I am sure a lot of people like the white sport of 'Secret'.
Meilland has a white fragrant HT popular in Europe that I have yet to see. White Perfumella. Unsure how decent it is in North America. Etsy sells a similar 'Wedding Road', which is another Yves Piaget type like White Perfumella. They may or may not be the same rose or sisters. Its hard to tell with Etsy sourcing sometimes, but it seems to be a very popular white sniffer HT there.
Anyway, a lot to select from.
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My JPII is super robust. It's first flish of blooms are often a bit bulbous and overpacked with petals.
The individual flowers that come later are more perfect.
What distinguishes any rose from all other flowers is its fragrance.
A rose without fragrance is only half a rose.
And a rose with super fragrance (like JPII) is a rose and a half.
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Steve - it sounds like you have a super plant of PJPii - more power to you!. I have what I believe is a Super Plant of Dolly Parton. I have tow bushes of Pope John Paul II. Both from Palatine so both on multiflora rootstock. Both are good and I will not be replacing them anytime soon. I just have a few other whites that I like better.
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You are probably right.
I just lucked into a super-robust graft & rootstock of JPII. I think I got it from Palatine also.
However, my favorite commercial rose (at theast for this week) is Pinkerbell.
It is also robust, needs little or no spraying and gets pretty flowers.
There are too few of them for the size of the plant and they are a bit small and need more fragrance,
but it is fertile as both a seed and pollen parent and its hardiness cannot be overlooked.
I say "commerical rose" because I also breed roses and have developed a few that I think are stellar.
I have not yet tried to find a distributor for them. But at my age, I can't wait around too
much longer.
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I've got some on the market. Getting your foot in the door takes at least several years, timing, and luck.
After you're in with a grower it gets easier, but even then the competition is overwhelming. We are competing with literally dozens of world class entities.
A stellar rose in one climate may not be stellar elsewhere.
Some very mediocre roses make it to market and other excellent ones are never offered. There are myriads of reasons why.
I also like 'Pinkerbelle'. I've heard some clones get several feet tall. Mine has always stayed in the 2' range, and yes, it has good fertility
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What a Rock Star of a rose! It blooms and blooms and the flowers are long lasting, huge and sparkly with a beautiful swirly form. This rose has a strong lemony soap scent, not my favorite but even if it weren't fragrant I would still grow this rose. It is always low growing, VERY low thorns, bushy, and 99% disease free year to year. The only drawbacks to this rose is that the stems aren't always strong enough to hold the gigantic blooms but most of the time they are!
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It is true that during certain times of the year (midsummer) the scent skirts the line between citrus and Windex window spray. I had seen someone else post this same comment somewhere but I cannot find their comment any more to tell them that they were not crazy. The smell is very good in spring and fall, however, and it's a beautiful, crazy bloomer all growing season.
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Windex. LOL. You just made my night :]
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Fantastic reviews. I appreciate the excellent info. you gave on scent. Your honesty is admirable.
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I was just thinking the same thing about this rose's scent. It reminds me of soap when I smell it. Good to know I'm not the only one, haha.
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A "cadillac" of roses for sure but you have to really 'baby" it to get it to grow well. A pot with prepared special soil is best.
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For some reason I have Wagner as the introducer in 2010, but I have also had a thought that it might have been Swanes?
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Geoffrey, you might find it helpful to skim through the references.
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Reply
#2 of 6 posted
12 OCT 18 by
Geoffrey
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Thanks Patricia, you have mentioned 'references' before, but I confess to not knowing how to access them. Hard for a fella to do this, but, teeth gritted, I am forced to so :D
So how do I check them out?
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So easy Geoffrey.
Open the rose's file. Up the top you will see:
Photos Lineage Awards References Member Ratings....etc.
Click on References - and there they are - in chronological order with the earliest (first) refs at the bottom, and the latest at the top.
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#4 of 6 posted
12 OCT 18 by
Geoffrey
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GREAT, many thanks for showing me the obvious! If you want to hide something from me, put it right in front!.
But this begs the question, why doesn't the main page show Swanes as the introducer? What have I missed?
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I believe Swane's are part of a group of nurseries calling themselves collectively, Rose Introducers of Australia.
Often a nursery in NSW will introduce a rose there, and in the same year, the Victorian member will introduce it there and the Western Australia member ....etc. It is often impossible to work out just who was the first. And when they change the rose name to something they think will sell better in Australia......well, that's when the fun starts.
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#6 of 6 posted
12 OCT 18 by
Geoffrey
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Nothing like a clear answer that is like mud! However, this answers a lot of unanswerable questions as to plats' heritage.
I do thank you for your patience and your sage advice.
No doubt, I will be back for more :).
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