HELPMEFIND PLANTS COMMERCIAL NON-COMMERCIAL RESOURCES EVENTS PEOPLE RATINGS
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Initial post
27 AUG 05 by
Mattie
I think I have a Manou Meilland in my garden. When we purchased the home it was here, however, I have a rose book stating it is a 'bedding rose', and your listing calls it a 'tea rose' with large flowers. I believe these are two different rose catagories. Can you tell me, which is the correct catagory? I don't know how to trim it back properly, and thought to know for certain what kind of rose it is, would be helpful in this area. Thank you very much, Mattie
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Mattie.......
I just checked the rose classification for 'Manou Meilland' on the rose page. The rose is listed as a "hybrid tea" which is a different classification than a "tea" rose. You are correct in that you would certainly prune hybrid tea roses differently than you would tea roses. Tea roses take time to build wood and mature into a solid plant. This indicates that they are the kind of roses which would "resent" being pruned hard. Experience in pruning tea roses seems to justify this assumption. Hybrid teas vary in how they like to be pruned. Some of them can be pruned quite hard and they will come back fine, while others will sulk. It takes experience working with the rose to find out how it performs best in your garden and in your climate zone.
As for classifying the rose as a bedding rose, hybrid tea roses can have heights anywhere from three feet tall to over seven feet tall. So, as a class, it's hard to define them as bedding roses.
I prefer to do what I call a "clean prune" and clear out old wood, diseased wood and congested center growth. Then depending on my experience with the rose, when shaping it, I tend to be conservative in the amount of wood I take off of a plant in that modern roses store most of their nutrients in their canes. Doing a hard prune on some of these roses would be robbing them of their food basket and creating stress for the plant. In general, hybrid teas can be pruned harder than tea roses.
Smiles,
Lyn helpmefind.com
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#2 of 3 posted
26 SEP 05 by
Mattie
Hello Lyn, thank you for your reply and the information on the Manou Meilland rose I inquiried about. You are correct in that this web page calls it a Hybrid tea, not a 'tea rose'. My error. I have a book specifically on roses, that calls the Manou Meilland, a bedding rose. I'm a bit confused still. This rose bush is about 5 feet high or higher. It blossoms like a bedding rose in that I have flowers on it almost constantly. It is very thorny. They call it a pink rose, although it is red to me, and then fads very easily with the sun to a pale red/pink, with a lemony scent. I took photos today, one of the flower and the other of the large bush before I cleaned it as you mentioned. Perhaps it is not a Manou Meilland. I looks just like the photo in the Rose Speciality Book I have. Many thanks again. And, for the delay of my reply, I've been out of town. The system will only allow me to attach one photo.
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I don't think your rose is MM.
Bedding rose typically means, although it could vary by culture, that it is one of the bush types (Poly, FL, GR, HT), as opposed to patio types, climbing types, species types, or shrub types. I think the use of bedding rose is mainly to say that unlike a patio or shrub, they can fit in beds, spaced 3-4' apart, in a pattern.
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Initial post
12 OCT 05 by
Mattie
When we purchased our home this rose bush was here. The first year it bloomed with one rose. The following with 2-3 roses. A friend advised I cut it down and plant something else, but now 2 years ago, in late spring I found it with 12-14 buds, and by summer most of them had opened. I do not know the name, nor have I been able to find anyone who can identify it. Please help. I don't know what all to say about it. It grows tall, and doesn't seem to climb, yet it could be a climber. It was planted where it really doesn't have anything to climb against. I've attached a photo of the bloom this summer, 2005. It sends out all kinds of new growth, after the first bloom, but those stems never or rarely produce additional flowers. It could be the way I'm cutting it back, I do not know how to prune it properly.
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#1 of 4 posted
15 OCT 05 by
Wendy C
You've got a pretty bloom, nice photo. I did a search and found a couple of possiblities, but they are reblooming varieties. Anne Morrow Lindberg or Antigone look similar.
It could be you have an inferior cultivor, or it's a once blooming rose. Prune the rose to a solid set of five leaflets pointing to the outside of the bush.
Climbing roses will not climb on their own. They tend to arch and spread without training. You can attach the rose to the trellis with old hosiery or nylon zip ties. Leave them with lots of wiggle room, so you don't strangle the cane.
If this rose isn't what you want, not enough bloom, ect, don't feel badly about digging it up and planting a variety which will make you happier.
Cutting it to the ground will not get rid of it. It needs to be dug up to be rid of it.
The condition you describe sounds like black spot. There are a number of products you could spray the plant with to eliminate the problem. Removing effected foliage and cleaning it out of the garden will help as well.
Good luck
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#2 of 4 posted
15 OCT 05 by
Mattie
Thank you Wendy C.. I appreciate your efforts in trying to identify this rose. I looked up both names you gave me, and you are right, it could be either from the photos I saw. It does rebloom but it takes forever to bud again. The scent is incredibly strong and wonderful, making me want to keep it. And, you can see from the photo, the blooms are gorgeous.
When you say prune to five leaflets, what do you mean exactly? The stock is thick and filled with thorns. I have kept those to five stocks/stems. But, I don't think one would call them leaflets. I do cut the stems back to the fifth leaf, when I'm trimming it back after a blossom, but normally another bud is not formed on that stem at all. And, those stems grow very high and fast. This year I tried to watch it a little more closely, and I think I found that new stem shoots grow from the big 5 stems, and they sometimes bud out. But, the long, fast growing stems don't give me flowers. They get about 10-12 feet high. One thing I failed to mention, is I live in the southeast corner of France..so naming it could be a little more difficult, perhaps? Many thanks for your time and effort in helping me. Mattie
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#3 of 4 posted
16 OCT 05 by
Wendy C
You're certainly welcome. Yes, France makes the ID more difficult. ;-)
Generally roses have three types of leaf sets. 3,5 & 7 leaves to a set or cluster . Most roses have 3 & 5 leaves on a stem. Conventional pruning says to cut just above a set of 5 leaves. So it sounds as if you are pruning it properly. The rose has it's own ideas on how it wants to behave.
Good luck with your fragrant beauty.
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#4 of 4 posted
16 OCT 05 by
Mattie
Dear Wendy C. I understand the leaf sets mentioned in your earlier reply to me - so, I think I'm doing what you suggested. Many thanks, Mattie
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